Welcome Guest Search | Active Topics | Members | Log In

Poll Question: When should a player be allowed to take over USA ?
Choice Votes Statistics
From 36 5 33%
From Vichy 2 13%
From Pearl Harbour 5 33%
Depends on who play what 3 20%

Merging the 2 rulesets. Options · View
hiensen
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 3:17:01 AM
 Generalleutnant

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 18000th Post

Joined: 1/27/2008
Posts: 1,331
Location: Pau, France
It says all, the poll ending will tell me how I'll merge the two rulesets.
Gen.Schuermann
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:09:15 AM
 Generalfeldmarschall

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 9000th Post

Joined: 3/5/2007
Posts: 3,505
Location: guarding Democracy
What exactly are we merging here?

In Soviet Russia, Schuermann defeats YOU!
cueball
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:21:57 AM
 Tribunus laticlavius

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalInspiring Poster '08 AwardAuthor of 10000th Post

Joined: 11/30/2007
Posts: 2,501
Location: Canaduh
One comment I will make on this is that 1.3 spy system has not been tweaked. From the reports I was reading, its seems that USA is able to get boffo amounts of BP's by hitting up ai countries, and possibly even player countries using its substantial cash. SOL, our resident "no USA from start" is an insult to all that is good in the world and plainly unfair (not to mention just plain unAmerican!)", says that he was able to snag 3 to 4 BP's a month with USA up until about 1940. Well, to me that sounds pretty unbalancing in an MP game.

For a straighforward copy over zip version go here: Goerings Delay -- NZQS -- 1.3b.rar

The Mod can also be set up with the Jones Generic Mod Enabler and has worked fine in that mode in my tests. This version has everything in it, 1.3beta, JSGME and the East is Red patch, and can be installed straight to your Armageddon 1.2 (ZBLV) folder without disrupting vanilla at all. It has the 1.3beta exe update and JGSME Mod system right in it. Just unzip to your main doomsday folder, copy the contents of the folder, then past into the main folder, then enable the mod using the JSGME system. Once you execute the JSGME it is pretty self-explanatory: EIR NZQS --ARMA 1.3beta complete 1.3b

Small patch from XTPS or NZQS 1.2 to NZQS 1.3b: Goering EIR -- Patch 1.3b

It would be a dangerous folly for the British people to underrate the enduring position in world history which Mussolini will hold; or the amazing qualities of courage, comprehension, self-control and perseverance which he exemplifies.

Sir Winston -- 1937
Vissarion
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:29:56 AM
 Lieutenant General

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 14000th Post

Joined: 3/6/2007
Posts: 1,715
Location: Norway
The USA player could just keep himself from doing it. I see no reason to keep a player from a nation just because he has the possibility to do something that is unbalancing. It's however too long ago since I last played a standard scenario to vote on this.

boing boom tschak, boing boom tschak
peng
boing boom tschak, boing boom tschak
zong
cueball
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:35:30 AM
 Tribunus laticlavius

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalInspiring Poster '08 AwardAuthor of 10000th Post

Joined: 11/30/2007
Posts: 2,501
Location: Canaduh
My experience is that adding more rules, only makes people read the rules less. The fundamental fact is that USA is unbalancing. Period.

For a straighforward copy over zip version go here: Goerings Delay -- NZQS -- 1.3b.rar

The Mod can also be set up with the Jones Generic Mod Enabler and has worked fine in that mode in my tests. This version has everything in it, 1.3beta, JSGME and the East is Red patch, and can be installed straight to your Armageddon 1.2 (ZBLV) folder without disrupting vanilla at all. It has the 1.3beta exe update and JGSME Mod system right in it. Just unzip to your main doomsday folder, copy the contents of the folder, then past into the main folder, then enable the mod using the JSGME system. Once you execute the JSGME it is pretty self-explanatory: EIR NZQS --ARMA 1.3beta complete 1.3b

Small patch from XTPS or NZQS 1.2 to NZQS 1.3b: Goering EIR -- Patch 1.3b

It would be a dangerous folly for the British people to underrate the enduring position in world history which Mussolini will hold; or the amazing qualities of courage, comprehension, self-control and perseverance which he exemplifies.

Sir Winston -- 1937
Vissarion
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:51:21 AM
 Lieutenant General

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 14000th Post

Joined: 3/6/2007
Posts: 1,715
Location: Norway
cueball wrote:
My experience is that adding more rules, only makes people read the rules less. The fundamental fact is that USA is unbalancing. Period.

'Tis true. If I were the USA player I'd think Vichy might be the best time, or if I was looking for a real challenge at USA war entry. each game is different, so sometimes Axis might have won by the time USA enters or they could be struggling bad even without a human US. It all comes down to the skill of players, and if you want to (artificially) keep the alliances in balance for as long as possible. We can hope that the US dilemma is handled better in hoi3.

boing boom tschak, boing boom tschak
peng
boing boom tschak, boing boom tschak
zong
hiensen
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 11:52:54 AM
 Generalleutnant

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 18000th Post

Joined: 1/27/2008
Posts: 1,331
Location: Pau, France
Gen.Schuermann wrote:
What exactly are we merging here?


Here's the boy who post faster than he read.One Tooth Grin
In the case you haven't noticed there are two different rulesets (1+1 :-d ) for vanilla games, each have a different philosophy concerning the playability of usa by an human player and I'm merging them into a single one in order to simplify the things while I'm modifying stuffs to fit with 1.3 patch.


@ I'm up for something very flexible concerning USA, depending on players skills like vissarion noted but my heart is still balancing for PH which I like much with a USA really in trouble when it joins the war.
Ederon
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 12:24:58 PM
 Field Major


Joined: 2/28/2007
Posts: 5,949
Location: Heart of Europe
I'd be for good old after Vichy doctrine, which is common since hoi1 and is a good compromise.
SilverBolt
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 1:17:50 PM
 Centurion

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 4/24/2008
Posts: 848
USA may be played after vichy if theres a human chinaoid.
If Not Human can go USA when japan attacks.
Olen
Posted: Saturday, January 24, 2009 4:58:47 PM
 Private 1st Class

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 11/8/2007
Posts: 28
I have voted for "USA from Pearl Harbour event". Even a noob can produce mass of FTRs if he is told to do so...
sonofliberty
Posted: Saturday, January 24, 2009 10:05:27 PM
Free Man

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalBiggest Spammer '08 Award

Joined: 3/5/2007
Posts: 4,329
Obviously should be from the start, just like everybody else.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. -- That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, -- That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."

There is a new game on the way Project Blitzkrieg
SilverBolt
Posted: Sunday, January 25, 2009 1:09:21 AM
 Centurion

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 4/24/2008
Posts: 848
sonofliberty wrote:
Obviously should be from the start, just like everybody else.



LOL
TheWretchedMass
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 7:36:26 AM
 Major

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 5/22/2008
Posts: 461
I hit by 36 by accident ment to hit from pearl harbor
hiensen
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 10:41:07 AM
 Generalleutnant

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 18000th Post

Joined: 1/27/2008
Posts: 1,331
Location: Pau, France
TheWretchedMass wrote:
I hit by 36 by accident ment to hit from pearl harbor


In that case send a pm to daniel for him to fix it.
Mighty G
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 1:12:12 PM
 Tribunus laticlavius

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 12/3/2007
Posts: 2,218
Location: Land of the Bunyip
D-Day was performed with 7 Divisions.

Lets see one of you do that in DD when Germany has the coast uber stacked with 15 divs.

Human USA from 36. anything else is just weak as piss.

9 Months after Pearl harbour, the yanks were kicking ass in the pacific with significantly small numbers. The problem is the game doesnt replicate historical facts like Jap air planes having supreme range but shit armour. 1 or 2 bullets and they were dead. I remember reading about some hellcats they pulled up with over 500 bullets in the the pilots armour plated seat.

too many ifs and butts for my liking. Just hav e the yanks as humans...


BTW aussie rules were updated a few weeks ago its posted in the sticky yay


If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever.
George Orwell

SilverBolt
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 4:09:30 PM
 Centurion

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 4/24/2008
Posts: 848
who voted for usa from 36 must go japan next game. Thumbs Up
hiensen
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 4:17:14 PM
 Generalleutnant

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 18000th Post

Joined: 1/27/2008
Posts: 1,331
Location: Pau, France
Mighty G wrote:

9 Months after Pearl harbour, the yanks were kicking ass in the pacific with significantly small numbers. The problem is the game doesnt replicate historical facts like Jap air planes having supreme range but shit armour. 1 or 2 bullets and they were dead. I remember reading about some hellcats they pulled up with over 500 bullets in the the pilots armour plated seat.

too many ifs and butts for my liking. Just hav e the yanks as humans...




What I would like to see here is a USA not kicking ass from day one of war either in the pacific and the atlantic (which happen when it's human from 36)

Hiensen wrote:
-in other hand USA will not be played by human until japan declare war on allies or 1rst jan 42 for the following reasons :

->1 : Japan will have more operational units than USA at war, for USA Guam will no longer be an untakable check point from where he can start an early invasion of Japan or destruction of his convoys, now the Japs DOW will reflect a surprising attack against unprepared USA
->2 : USA will not be perfectly prepared for a war against Germany anymore, USA will need several months to stack a large enough army to make a D-Day or Husky operation while at same time he will have to deal with Japanese naval power

-USA entry in war is now more dependant on Axis actions: the more the axis break historical line earlier USA might be able to join the Allies


Mighty G wrote:


BTW aussie rules were updated a few weeks ago its posted in the sticky yay


Aussie rules are a way too much favouring the allies, uk can easily kick butts in the siegfried since there are no bulgaria and romania in axis ( which I complained about and you guys adopted my rule concerning them), same hapenned with the urban limit there was none ( which I asked for a change too ), and uk is been total free to stack up in netherland indies like I did in our game, japan couldn't move any finger around there and got stuck in india, while usa was tranquilly stacking up in his islands and australia. etc etc etc
Aussie rules still need work concerning the allies, you guys just got lucky putting noobs or sleepy players on it, it's a choice but in other hand there's no fun kicking uk arses without serious opposition.



@Anyways what we do with yankees is being voted, which is the best way to end up this endless debate concerning the USA.
cueball
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 9:01:27 PM
 Tribunus laticlavius

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalInspiring Poster '08 AwardAuthor of 10000th Post

Joined: 11/30/2007
Posts: 2,501
Location: Canaduh
Mighty G wrote:
D-Day was performed with 7 Divisions.

Lets see one of you do that in DD when Germany has the coast uber stacked with 15 divs.

Human USA from 36. anything else is just weak as piss.



Talking about realistic levels of division deployments in vanilla HOI is pointless. Even the at start 1936 OBB's for the countries are terribly out of wack with the historical. UK has twice the number of divisions it had in 1939, for one thing. All of the mp growth rates are wacked, and when it comes time to build all of the major pwers have armies 2 to 3 times larger than they did historically.

For a straighforward copy over zip version go here: Goerings Delay -- NZQS -- 1.3b.rar

The Mod can also be set up with the Jones Generic Mod Enabler and has worked fine in that mode in my tests. This version has everything in it, 1.3beta, JSGME and the East is Red patch, and can be installed straight to your Armageddon 1.2 (ZBLV) folder without disrupting vanilla at all. It has the 1.3beta exe update and JGSME Mod system right in it. Just unzip to your main doomsday folder, copy the contents of the folder, then past into the main folder, then enable the mod using the JSGME system. Once you execute the JSGME it is pretty self-explanatory: EIR NZQS --ARMA 1.3beta complete 1.3b

Small patch from XTPS or NZQS 1.2 to NZQS 1.3b: Goering EIR -- Patch 1.3b

It would be a dangerous folly for the British people to underrate the enduring position in world history which Mussolini will hold; or the amazing qualities of courage, comprehension, self-control and perseverance which he exemplifies.

Sir Winston -- 1937
Mighty G
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 9:44:37 PM
 Tribunus laticlavius

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 12/3/2007
Posts: 2,218
Location: Land of the Bunyip
Exactly my point cue.

Why allow the other nations to build behemoth armed forces and nerf the USA to being able to do nothing until 1943.

I never choose the ''Win in France" as the Allies cause i find it somewhat below me, so sitting back for 4 years waiting for US troops to help stop the shit tide against USSR i dont find much fun.



If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever.
George Orwell

TheWretchedMass
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 9:54:26 PM
 Major

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 5/22/2008
Posts: 461
UK can handle the Japs by themselves. USA didnt have much to fight with till 43 either, they had 1 operational carrier in the battle of the santa cruz islands, and to call enterprise operational is just lol. Naw I think the current 1.2 rule set is fine.
hiensen
Posted: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 11:29:10 PM
 Generalleutnant

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 18000th Post

Joined: 1/27/2008
Posts: 1,331
Location: Pau, France
The poll is still undecided, if we keep this way I guess we might have to stay with two different rulesets adapted to the circumstances. One Tooth Grin
cueball
Posted: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 11:49:20 PM
 Tribunus laticlavius

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalInspiring Poster '08 AwardAuthor of 10000th Post

Joined: 11/30/2007
Posts: 2,501
Location: Canaduh
Well, you could look at it from the opposite point of view, and determine how long it is before Japan can enter the war after USA becomes human.

It seems like saying most people are saying after PH, which is kind of weird in terms of set up. Would it be Canada/USA in that case?

For a straighforward copy over zip version go here: Goerings Delay -- NZQS -- 1.3b.rar

The Mod can also be set up with the Jones Generic Mod Enabler and has worked fine in that mode in my tests. This version has everything in it, 1.3beta, JSGME and the East is Red patch, and can be installed straight to your Armageddon 1.2 (ZBLV) folder without disrupting vanilla at all. It has the 1.3beta exe update and JGSME Mod system right in it. Just unzip to your main doomsday folder, copy the contents of the folder, then past into the main folder, then enable the mod using the JSGME system. Once you execute the JSGME it is pretty self-explanatory: EIR NZQS --ARMA 1.3beta complete 1.3b

Small patch from XTPS or NZQS 1.2 to NZQS 1.3b: Goering EIR -- Patch 1.3b

It would be a dangerous folly for the British people to underrate the enduring position in world history which Mussolini will hold; or the amazing qualities of courage, comprehension, self-control and perseverance which he exemplifies.

Sir Winston -- 1937
TheWretchedMass
Posted: Wednesday, January 28, 2009 12:17:09 AM
 Major

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership Medal

Joined: 5/22/2008
Posts: 461
hiensen wrote:
In that case send a pm to daniel for him to fix it.


Who is daniel
sonofliberty
Posted: Wednesday, January 28, 2009 12:50:05 AM
Free Man

Forum Supporter Medal 1st ClassOne Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalBiggest Spammer '08 Award

Joined: 3/5/2007
Posts: 4,329
TheWretchedMass wrote:
Who is daniel
Our illustrious leader, Lord Ederon.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. -- That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, -- That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."

There is a new game on the way Project Blitzkrieg
hiensen
Posted: Wednesday, January 28, 2009 3:10:15 AM
 Generalleutnant

One Year Membership MedalTwo Year Membership MedalAuthor of 18000th Post

Joined: 1/27/2008
Posts: 1,331
Location: Pau, France
cueball wrote:
Well, you could look at it from the opposite point of view, and determine how long it is before Japan can enter the war after USA becomes human.

It seems like saying most people are saying after PH, which is kind of weird in terms of set up. Would it be Canada/USA in that case?


Yes like we've done.
Users browsing this topic
Guest


Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Powered by Yet Another Forum.net version 1.9.0 (NET v2.0) - 10/10/2006
Copyright © 2003-2006 Yet Another Forum.net. All rights reserved.
Copyright © 2005-2007 Daniel "Lord Ederon" Scibrany. All rights reserved.