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Forgiven
Posted: Wednesday, June 09, 2010 2:47:22 PM
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Location: Up north (cet+1)
Population check (for ever trusting wiki) actually gives;
Germany 69 mill
USA 131 mill
Soviet 168 mill
on 1st of January 1939, so I assume that includes the few million Austrians and whatever of Sudeten that are counted...
...so the difference is not quite as huge as 50-200-200, but it's still there, true.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Which is a problem, if you are powerless.
Ederon
Posted: Wednesday, June 09, 2010 4:04:13 PM
 Field Major


Joined: 2/28/2007
Posts: 5,949
Location: Heart of Europe
If you are interested in some figures:

Population (mil) / GDP (bn $ in 1990 prices) /per capita 1938 ($ in 1990 prices):

UK - 47.5 / 284.2 / 5,983
UK dominions - 42.0 / 185.6 / 3,817
UK colonie - 453.8 / 284.5 / 627
France - 42.0 / 185.6 / 4,424
French colonies - 70.9 / 48.5 / 684
Poland - 35.1 / 76.6 / 2,182
Czechoslovakia - 10.5 / 30.3 / 2,882

USA - 130.5 / 800 / 6,134
US colonies - 17.8 / 26.5 / 1,495

USSR - 167.0 / 359 / 2,150

Germany - 68.6 / 351.4 / 5,126
Austria - 6.8 / 24.2 / 3,583
Italy - 43.4 / 140.8 / 3,244
Italian colonies - 8.5 / 2.6 / 304
Japan - 71.0 / 169.4 / 2,356
Japanese colonies - 59.8 / 62.9 / 1,052

China - 411.7 / 320 / 778


Wartime GDP (bn $ in 1990 prices / military burden - % GDP spent on military / armed forces [thousands])
Code:
Country       1938            1939               1940                1941                1942                 1943                 1944                 1945
USA      800 / -- / --   869 /  1 / -----   943 /  2 / -----  1,094 / 11 / 1,620  1,235 / 31 /  3,970  1,399 / 42 /  9,020  1,499 / 42 / 11,410  1,474 / -- / 11,430
UK       284 / -- / --   287 / 15 /   480   316 / 44 / 2,273    344 / 53 / 3,383    353 / 52 /  4,091    361 / 55 /  4,761    346 / 53 /  4,967    331 / -- /  5,090
France   186 / -- / --   199 / -- / 5,000   164 / -- / 7,000    130 / -- / -----    116 / -- / ------    110 / -- / ------     93 / -- / ------      - / -- / ------
USSR     359 / -- / --   366 / -- / -----   417 / 17 / 5,000    359 / 28 / 7,100    318 / 61 / 11,340    464 / 61 / 11,858    495 / 53 / 12,225    396 / -- / 12,100
Germany  351 / -- / --   384 / 23 / 4,522   387 / 40 / 5,762    412 / 52 / 7,309    417 / 64 /  8,410    426 / 70 /  9,480    437 / -- /  9,420    310 / -- /  7,830
Italy    141 / -- / --   151 /  8 / 1,740   147 / 12 / 2.340    144 / 23 / 3,227    145 / 22 /  3,810    137 / 21 /  3,815    117 / -- / ------     92 / -- / ------
Japan    169 / -- / --   184 / 22 / -----   192 / 22 / 1,630    196 / 27 / 2,420    197 / 33 /  2,840    194 / 43 /  3,700    189 / 76 /  5,380    144 / -- /  7,730
Gen.Schuermann
Posted: Wednesday, June 09, 2010 4:18:24 PM
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fucking italy spent squat on the military Mad
poor show, musso!

@mod itself:
I agree we should leave diplomatical things aside this time, only stuff we know that is unbalanced and has been unchanged since 1.4, which in the end is only production.

In Soviet Russia, Schuermann defeats YOU!
Ederon
Posted: Thursday, June 10, 2010 10:34:50 PM
 Field Major


Joined: 2/28/2007
Posts: 5,949
Location: Heart of Europe
So, without going too far with US manpower events, I've implemented this:

- removed those DoW decisions which granted US 300 MP
- added 300 MP after Vichy
- added 300 MP after Soviet Bitter Peace (this is long shot, but it's logicial IMO)
- added 100 MP after fall of China (Nat. China, as biggest chinese country)

Rest remains unchanged. Please try it, test it.

File Attachment(s):
mod_SF_YVVZ.rar (104kb) downloaded 25 time(s).
vanilla_SF_2_0_NNTI.rar (101kb) downloaded 26 time(s).


Gen.Schuermann
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 12:00:46 AM
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i have thuroughly tested the last one, whcih looks very good.
I have to check province reconstruction more though, but it looks solid from here Smile

In Soviet Russia, Schuermann defeats YOU!
Ederon
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 12:51:57 AM
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Posts: 5,949
Location: Heart of Europe
One thing to mod yet would be no Slovakia after end of Czechoslovakia
Gen.Schuermann
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 11:44:32 AM
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Oh yes, that would save us some time indeed.

In Soviet Russia, Schuermann defeats YOU!
sangeli
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 11:58:45 AM
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Hmm...doesn't increasing the practical from engineers but decreasing it from motorised just enourage people to build 3xArm + 1 Eng? As Japan that won't be an issue, but if I were Germany or the USSR I wouldn't build any other sort of armor. And IMO, that division is more gamey than the 3xArm + 1 Mot that many people use.
Gen.Schuermann
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 12:10:59 PM
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3Arm + 1 Eng would be very soft iirc plus relatively slow. in our games rarely anybody used eng in armor iirc.

In Soviet Russia, Schuermann defeats YOU!
sangeli
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 12:19:13 PM
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Gen.Schuermann wrote:
3Arm + 1 Eng would be very soft iirc plus relatively slow. in our games rarely anybody used eng in armor iirc.

Soft? How about 38 softness. And since units will now keep fighting even if a support is out of org, that weakness is removed. And slow? Engineers are faster than armor and about the same speed as motorised. Plus they give movement bonuses in bad terrain so it actually makes it faster. Just because no one has used it yet in your game, doens't mean no one will. Especially now that I've spilled the beans Wink
Hytzon
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 12:23:48 PM
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I used a tank corps full of 3 ARM + 1 ENG in our last game with great success on the eastern front. But engineers do require different doctrines and I don't think their speed ever increases above 8, meaning they are not suited for very fast armored divisions. But Sangeli might be right, the is no real reason to up the ENG practicals.

You can't say civilization don't advance - for in every war, they kill you in a new way.
sangeli
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 12:27:46 PM
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Hytzon wrote:
I used a tank corps full of 3 ARM + 1 ENG in our last game with great success on the eastern front. But engineers do require different doctrines and I don't think their speed ever increases above 8, meaning they are not suited for very fast armored divisions.

I'm pretty sure the techs increse engineer speed 0.5 per level. Also, since many defensive lines are on rivers they are incredibly useful. In fighting for France often times the battle comes down to engineer reinforced tanks crossing the meuse river.
teamgene
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 12:49:58 PM
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I believe Forgiven used 3ARM 1 ENG and 4ARM 1 ENG in XIII as well.
Ederon
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 1:12:37 PM
 Field Major


Joined: 2/28/2007
Posts: 5,949
Location: Heart of Europe
This is complete proposition:

General
Code:
- Italy gets more base IC
- when USA loses Pacific bases, it gets 300 MP
- when Vichy is created, USA gets 300 MP
- when Nationalist China is annexed, USA gets 100 MP
- when SOV loses key cities in West Russia, it gains 500 MP
- when ROM loses Bessarabia, it gets 50 MP[/b]
- fixed partisans popping up in impassable territory
- Slovakia is not created on End of Czechoslovakia event and former Slovak territory goes to Hungary


common/defines.lua
Code:
SPY_DETECTION_CHANCE     =0.07,  --0.1,
BUILDING_REPAIR_SPEED         = 0.25,    -- 0.1,
SUPPLYPOOL_DAYS = 20,    -- 30,    -- days of supply.
BASE_FORT_PENALTY = -0.075,   -- -0.09,


common/buildings.txt
Code:
air_base = {
    cost = 3    #2
    time = 120    #180
}

naval_base = {
    cost = 7,5    #5
    time = 120    #180
}

coastal_fort = {
    cost = 7.5    #5
    time = 120    #180
}

land_fort = {
    cost = 7.5    #5
    time = 120    #180
}

infra = {
    cost = 2    #1
    time = 180    #365
}


units\armor_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 0.6    #1.7
    on_completion = armour_practical


units\bergsjaeger_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 0.45    #3
    on_completion = infantry_practical


units\cag.txt
Code:
    build_cost_ic = 8.75    #3.50
    build_time = 200    #500
    completion_size = 1.4    #1.8
    on_completion = single_engine_aircraft_practical


units\cas.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 1.2    #2.0
    on_completion = single_engine_aircraft_practical


units\heavy_armor_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 1.05    #2.5
    on_completion = armour_practical


units\infantry_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 0.4#0.2
    on_completion = infantry_practical


units\interceptor.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 1.2    #2.0
    on_completion = single_engine_aircraft_practical


units\light_armor_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 0.33    #1.0
    on_completion = armour_practical


units\marine_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 0.6    #0.3
    on_completion = infantry_practical


units\mechanized_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 0.9    #1.2
    on_completion = mobile_practical


units\motorized_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 0.45    #0.6
    on_completion = mobile_practical


units\multi_role.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 1.3    #2.1
    on_completion = single_engine_aircraft_practical


units\paratrooper_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 0.8    #0.4
    on_completion = infantry_practical


units\super_heavy_armor_brigade.txt
Code:
    completion_size = 1.05    #2.7
    on_completion = armour_practical


This is final proposition. I don't thing there is anything left to mod. So TRY, TEST - I can't and won't dow it alone. Thx

File Attachment(s):
mod_SF_DWNA.zip (145kb) downloaded 26 time(s).


Traks
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 2:03:00 PM
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I would leave multirole practicals as it is, because nobody makes them anyway.
Everything else looks perfect to try out.
Fiendix
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 2:32:47 PM
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- when USA loses Pacific bases, it gets 300 MP

this even is pointless as its prone to exploit. Japan wont take all the islands thus the event wont fire.

also if we are at it I would raise the cost of TP planes (a lot) and paratroopers to limit their use and exploit possibilities. Id also make them (TP and para) use much more leadership so that they are not spammed so easily.
Traks
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 2:41:44 PM
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While I partially agree, paratroopers are now nicely nerfed so we can try with default paratroopers.
And you need one TP plane but lot of paratroopers. So raising cost of plane is not so much of solution.
Fiendix
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 3:20:24 PM
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uhm im what way are they nerfed? I did think that they did the lose org for TPs after paradrop - seems they didnt?
Traks
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 3:29:56 PM
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1. They get -50% for any battle in which they are dropping.
2. They lost org and str immediately after drop.
3. You need 95% of max org to load them on Transport.
4. Their stats were weakened even further.

So for me they seem balanced at moment.
Ederon
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 4:01:19 PM
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Joined: 2/28/2007
Posts: 5,949
Location: Heart of Europe
Fiendix wrote:
- when USA loses Pacific bases, it gets 300 MP

this even is pointless as its prone to exploit. Japan wont take all the islands thus the event wont fire.

No, it's not pointless. This is the trigger:
Code:

            or = {
                10664 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } # Wake
                10669 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } # Midway
                10668 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } # Johnson Island
                10670 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } # Phoenix Island
                10666 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } # Jarvis Island
                10665 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } # Palmyra
                10667 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } # Chrismas Island
                6119 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } # Guam
                5825 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } #Honolulu
                7717 = { not = { controlled_by = USA } } #Panama
            }

So loss of ANY of those triggers MP gain. Those are bases. If Japan intends to go against US proper, they need the bases, not empty islands.
Fiendix
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 4:31:02 PM
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uhm indeed - then I guess its ok.
Ederon
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 5:52:17 PM
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Joined: 2/28/2007
Posts: 5,949
Location: Heart of Europe
There is one handsoff game I run well into 1941. I wanted to check Vichy trigger on US manpower and also the one where China gets annexed. Both of them fired propertly, giving USA 400 MP to play with. Soo fo yourself, analyze, comment.

File Attachment(s):
USA1941_01_12_23.rar (724kb) downloaded 24 time(s).
USA1941_05_25_17.rar (713kb) downloaded 24 time(s).


sangeli
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 8:39:20 PM
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With the new patch today, do you need to tweak the mod?
Ederon
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 8:49:41 PM
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Posts: 5,949
Location: Heart of Europe
Beta patch you mean? Is there already known schedule for this patch to become official? Should they release yet n betapatches, I cannot guarantee I'll be checking all mod files and merging them with beta.

If anyone have beta installed (or intends to install it), please check/compare /common/defines.lua of beta and vanilla SF 2.0, use fc command for that on command prompt. If they match, then you can use patch on beta without adaptation.
sangeli
Posted: Friday, June 11, 2010 9:41:55 PM
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Nevermind. Its probably not a good idea. I figured the Beta patch would solve more problems than it caused, but there appears to be a debilitating map cache problem. It's probably not a good idea to use the 2.01 Beta patch.
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